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Have I wasted $$ on a Pico?? (Read 956 times)

autosparky

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Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Nov 10^th, 2021 at 11:16pm

Investing heavily into Pico over the years, I'm now onto my 4th scope including a new 4425A to go with 2 x WPS and other accessories, now I'm having serious thoughts on my investment with the direction of Pico software.

Looking around and I discovered this, just look at the prices on some of their gear.
8Ch scope for $US220.

Check out this COP test lead and watch the video, the software is displaying Parade!!!

https://rotkee.com/en/product/lx1-sensor

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autosparky Super Nerd Picogroup Offline blind worker Posts: 2,537 Porirua New Zealand Gender:	Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico?? Reply #1 - Nov 11^th, 2021 at 12:36am This even displays misfire counter
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kicksbutt Guru Member Picogroup Offline I'm an Autonerd Posts: 252 litchfield park az Arizona USA	Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico?? Reply #2 - Nov 11^th, 2021 at 6:22am autosparky Yes I have come across this site also. They have an awesome probe you can attach to diesel fuel lines to get injector firings. their FLS probe is very nice and compact also. The only downside is that not alot of English support. I am also very interested in the software of the scope they have also.
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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #3 - Nov 11^th, 2021 at 10:31pm

autosparky wrote on Nov 10^th, 2021 at 11:16pm:

Check out this COP test lead and watch the video, the software is displaying Parade!!!

You could likely do that parade with Pico, but you would need a lot of COP probes (or maybe just tape your secondary probes onto the COPs Undecided

Undecided

). You'd connect some sort of sync for whatever cylinder you wanted, usually #1, on one particular channel. Next connect whatever amount of those BNC three way connectors you needed to get all the COP probe signals onto one channel. Or, maybe just buy their inductive cables for those ridiculously low prices to connect to Pico Cool

Cool

. Unfortunately you wouldn't get the very cool looking raster or the misfire counters that their software offers. Hmmm . . . you think Pico would ever offer the ability to trigger each individual channel so we could make our own raster waves? Nah, probably no money ignition waves anyway Cheesy

Cheesy

.

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autosparky

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #4 - Nov 11^th, 2021 at 10:50pm

crackerclicker wrote on Nov 11^th, 2021 at 10:31pm:

lot of COP probes (or maybe just tape your secondary probes onto the COPs

Did you see the probes on their website? or watch the video?? it comes with a roll of double sided tape Wink

Wink

Not only does it have misfire counter but also the stats on each cylinder for each cylinder is quite cool feature.

Sort of like Pico diagnostics

Now buying stuff from Russia with a credit card...what could go wrong Grin

Grin

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kicksbutt Guru Member Picogroup Offline I'm an Autonerd Posts: 252 litchfield park az Arizona USA	Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico?? Reply #5 - Nov 12^th, 2021 at 5:22am Autosparky, Thats the other thing. Payment kind of a hassle. Have to do a money gram. then email Rotkee to let them know you purchased something. Then the money never exactly matches up. IE the conversion rates I guess. I have ordered twice from them got both orders but took about two months.
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HarleyMike Super Nerd Picogroup Offline Posts: 1,308 Dinwiddie County Virginia USA Gender:	Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico?? Reply #6 - Nov 12^th, 2021 at 12:38pm I'm considering an 8 channel, anyone using an ATS scope?
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Steven McGrew

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #7 - Nov 12^th, 2021 at 3:09pm

HarleyMike wrote on Nov 12^th, 2021 at 12:38pm:

...anyone using an ATS scope?

The shop I work at uses one. I don't like the software, because the layout is not very user friendly, in my opinion. I think Bernie Thompson designed the software, so it probably suits him perfectly fine, but I get the feeling he did not get any feedback when designing it, so it's intuitive for him but not for others. That's my hunch, anyway. I would suggest test driving the software first, if that's possible.

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autosparky Super Nerd Picogroup Offline blind worker Posts: 2,537 Porirua New Zealand Gender:	Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico?? Reply #8 - Nov 12^th, 2021 at 10:29pm HarleyMike wrote on Nov 12^th, 2021 at 12:38pm: I'm considering an 8 channel, anyone using an ATS scope? You could buy this Russian unit and give a review, it's only $220 Or the Chinese Hantek for like $130 Might run like a steam engine
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kicksbutt

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #9 - Nov 13^th, 2021 at 6:38am

I was on the fence between the ATS 8 channel and the Pico 8 channel. You can download the ATS software and play with it. Like Steven said just a whole lot going on in such a small space. I did not like it. If you watch Bernie's videos even he has a hard time working that screen. I ultimately went with the Pico. BUT the Rotkee and ATS both have some nice software features. You would think Pico would be eyeing the competition and have something similar. What do I know though. Just my two cents

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Tom Roberts

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #10 - Nov 13^th, 2021 at 9:08am

Quote:

I was on the fence between the ATS 8 channel and the Pico 8 channel

Unless they came out with something new I am not familiar with, the ATS scope, while it has interesting features, is a low end performance scope. ADC is too slow to do CAN for example.

I'll never forget the look on Bernie's face when he discovered that the Snap-On Modis was out performing his ATS. I am sure I had a similar expression when I found the Modis out performing the first PicoScope automotive offering which was the 212/3.

Of course, PicoScope has evolved where the ATS has not. The ATS has been repackaged many times but the performance has not improved in the last couple of decades.

Now, of course, the PicoScope is literally over a thousand times more powerful than the Snap-On scopes.

The PicoScope 8 channel is also very high performing and can actually out perform the Pico four channel models using only four of eight.

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Logic

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #11 - Nov 13^th, 2021 at 6:52pm

Tom Roberts wrote on Nov 13^th, 2021 at 9:08am:

Quote:

I was on the fence between the ATS 8 channel and the Pico 8 channel

Unless they came out with something new I am not familiar with, the ATS scope, while it has interesting features, is a low end performance scope. ADC is too slow to do CAN for example.

I'll never forget the look on Bernie's face when he discovered that the Snap-On Modis was out performing his ATS. I am sure I had a similar expression when I found the Modis out performing the first PicoScope automotive offering which was the 212/3.

Of course, PicoScope has evolved where the ATS has not. The ATS has been repackaged many times but the performance has not improved in the last couple of decades.

Now, of course, the PicoScope is literally over a thousand times more powerful than the Snap-On scopes.

The PicoScope 8 channel is also very high performing and can actually out perform the Pico four channel models using only four of eight.

Welcome home Tom.

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autosparky

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #12 - Nov 13^th, 2021 at 11:48pm

Hi Tom, has retirement got boring already??

Here's a screen shot of intake using piezo sensor
again a parade pattern, really nice clean layout, cylinder identification and not shall what going on the right side screen but guessing stats

This is what Pico diagnostic should be like, what do you guys think??

This is giving me ideas, Trevor should start learning to speak Rusky and get Rotkee engineers to make the new Pico/autonerdz software Grin

Grin

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TrevorSchlientz

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #13 - Nov 14^th, 2021 at 2:49am

autosparky wrote on Nov 13^th, 2021 at 11:48pm:

This is giving me ideas, Trevor should start learning to speak Rusky and get Rotkee engineers to make the new Pico/autonerdz software

Ya know, that’s not a half bad idea. I can probably connect you with some of the hackers that try to break into these forums on a daily basis.

Seriously though, Pico distributes SDKs freely so a programmer should have all the tools they need to make custom software to be used with a PicoScope. The big issue I can see us running into, is the idea of paying thousands of dollars per user for the software. If you're bored Look into MATLAB and LABView. If you think scantool subscriptions are insane you should see what other industries have to pay to make their tools work.

Actually, when you think about it... If Pico were to implement subscriptions or licenses for the software they should make more than enough cash to be able to hire the Russian software engineers.

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Logic LSD Guide Picogroup Offline Posts: 4,147 Bentleigh Victoria Australia	Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico?? Reply #14 - Nov 14^th, 2021 at 11:22pm autosparky wrote on Nov 13^th, 2021 at 11:48pm: Hi Tom, has retirement got boring already?? Tony, Tom only comes back here to read your posts. Keeps him alive Good work mate, keep it up.
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autosparky

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #15 - Nov 18^th, 2021 at 1:14am

TrevorSchlientz wrote on Nov 14^th, 2021 at 2:49am:

you should see what other industries have to pay to make their tools work.

Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't of upgraded my scope with Pico If I didn't think it was a good product.
It's just that P7 just isn't doing it for me, sure it has some nice features but I find myself going back to P6 on certain jobs. If I had to pay for upgrade P7 now, would I....mmmmm??

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autosparky Super Nerd Picogroup Offline blind worker Posts: 2,537 Porirua New Zealand Gender:	Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico?? Reply #16 - Dec 22^nd, 2021 at 1:14am I never spent a dime in Vegas and yet I gambled and sent money to Russia cause I'm bored?
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autosparky

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #17 - Jan 11^th, 2022 at 11:15pm

With permission from Trevor I'm posting this as I didn't want to take away any Pico sales and also I'm stating I'm not in anyway affiliated with Rotkee, just posting my opinion on these products.

The goods arrived in 2 weeks which is really good considering this time of years.

I'm really happy with the quality of the test leads, nice thick flexible leads, metal BNC with gold contact

20220108_192359.jpg (990 KB | )

20220108_193019.jpg (1103 KB | )

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autosparky Super Nerd Picogroup Offline blind worker Posts: 2,537 Porirua New Zealand Gender:	Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico?? Reply #18 - Jan 11^th, 2022 at 11:59pm The car is 2014 Mazda COP using a variety of pick up leads
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autosparky Super Nerd Picogroup Offline blind worker Posts: 2,537 Porirua New Zealand Gender:	Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico?? Reply #19 - Jan 12^th, 2022 at 12:26am The vibration clamp was a little bigger than I would of liked, I couldn't directly clamp anywhere near a injector, only about 2 spots around the high pressure pump. This shot is clamped to the rocker cover and 1 coil unplugged
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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #20 - Jan 12^th, 2022 at 1:27am

autosparky wrote on Jan 12^th, 2022 at 12:26am:

The vibration clamp was a little bigger than I would of liked, I couldn't directly clamp anywhere near a injector, only about 2 spots around the high pressure pump.

This shot is clamped to the rocker cover and 1 coil unplugged

Put an aluminium overlay over the coil for comparison

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #21 - Jan 12^th, 2022 at 2:16pm

autosparky wrote on Jan 11^th, 2022 at 11:59pm:

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #18 - Yesterday at 11:59pm The car is 2014 Mazda COP
using a variety of pick up leads

Hi Autosparky,
From the pattern you posted, it appears you were able to connect your Rotkee scope to you laptop and use Pico7 software. Is this the case and how difficult was the marriage of the scope to the Pico7 software? Shocked

Shocked

Your pattern looks very clean and easy to read. Cool

Cool

Take care,
DougS

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #22 - Jan 12^th, 2022 at 7:51pm

autosparky wrote on Jan 12^th, 2022 at 12:26am:

The vibration clamp was a little bigger than I would of liked, I couldn't directly clamp anywhere near a injector, only about 2 spots around the high pressure pump.

This shot is clamped to the rocker cover and 1 coil unplugged

Put an aluminium overlay over the coil for comparison

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autosparky

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #23 - Jan 13^th, 2022 at 1:21am

Doug S. wrote on Jan 12^th, 2022 at 2:16pm:

autosparky wrote on Jan 11^th, 2022 at 11:59pm:

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #18 - Yesterday at 11:59pm The car is 2014 Mazda COP
using a variety of pick up leads

Hi Autosparky,
From the pattern you posted, it appears you were able to connect your Rotkee scope to you laptop and use Pico7 software. Is this the case and how difficult was the marriage of the scope to the Pico7 software? Shocked

Shocked

Your pattern looks very clean and easy to read. Cool

Cool

Take care,
DougS

A scope will read anything, the tricky part is designing something with the right sensitivity vs inductance/capacitance that will effect the wave shape.
Notice that I haven't had time to work out the voltage scaling yet

Logic wrote on Jan 12^th, 2022 at 7:51pm:

Put an aluminium overlay over the coil for comparison

I've tried that and placing various size coins and washers, my experimentation just wasn't consistent, the wave shape just wasn't right

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TrevorSchlientz

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #24 - Jan 13^th, 2022 at 6:42am

Doug S. wrote on Jan 12^th, 2022 at 2:16pm:

autosparky wrote on Jan 11^th, 2022 at 11:59pm:

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #18 - Yesterday at 11:59pm The car is 2014 Mazda COP
using a variety of pick up leads

Hi Autosparky,
From the pattern you posted, it appears you were able to connect your Rotkee scope to you laptop and use Pico7 software. Is this the case and how difficult was the marriage of the scope to the Pico7 software? Shocked

Shocked

Your pattern looks very clean and easy to read. Cool

Cool

Take care,
DougS

+1

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #25 - Jan 13^th, 2022 at 10:44am

TrevorSchlientz wrote on Jan 13^th, 2022 at 6:42am:

Doug S. wrote on Jan 12^th, 2022 at 2:16pm:

autosparky wrote on Jan 11^th, 2022 at 11:59pm:

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #18 - Yesterday at 11:59pm The car is 2014 Mazda COP
using a variety of pick up leads

Hi Autosparky,
From the pattern you posted, it appears you were able to connect your Rotkee scope to you laptop and use Pico7 software. Is this the case and how difficult was the marriage of the scope to the Pico7 software? Shocked

Shocked

Your pattern looks very clean and easy to read. Cool

Cool

Take care,
DougS

+1

I do not see that claim

.

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #26 - Jan 17^th, 2022 at 11:26am

Logic wrote on Jan 13^th, 2022 at 10:44am:

TrevorSchlientz wrote on Jan 13^th, 2022 at 6:42am:

Doug S. wrote on Jan 12^th, 2022 at 2:16pm:

[quote author=6B666F720A0 link=1636615000/18#18 date=1641974354]

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #18 - Yesterday at 11:59pm The car is 2014 Mazda COP
using a variety of pick up leads

Hi Autosparky,
From the pattern you posted, it appears you were able to connect your Rotkee scope to you laptop and use Pico7 software. Is this the case and how difficult was the marriage of the scope to the Pico7 software? Shocked

Shocked

I do not see that claim

.

My understanding is he was able to employ the rotkee accessories together with the picoscope and P7 software.

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #27 - Jan 17^th, 2022 at 12:18pm

JÜJA wrote on Jan 17^th, 2022 at 11:26am:

Logic wrote on Jan 13^th, 2022 at 10:44am:

TrevorSchlientz wrote on Jan 13^th, 2022 at 6:42am:

Doug S. wrote on Jan 12^th, 2022 at 2:16pm:

[quote author=6B666F720A0 link=1636615000/18#18 date=1641974354]

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #18 - Yesterday at 11:59pm The car is 2014 Mazda COP
using a variety of pick up leads

Hi Autosparky,
From the pattern you posted, it appears you were able to connect your Rotkee scope to you laptop and use Pico7 software. Is this the case and how difficult was the marriage of the scope to the Pico7 software? Shocked

Shocked

I do not see that claim

.

My understanding is he was able to employ the rotkee accessories together with the picoscope and P7 software.

Exactly, just as we can use any input that generates an electrical signal....like the Brandon FLS

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autosparky

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #28 - Jan 18^th, 2022 at 12:48am

Doug S. wrote on Jan 12^th, 2022 at 2:16pm:

Hi Autosparky,
From the pattern you posted, it appears you were able to connect your Rotkee scope to you laptop and use Pico7 software. Is this the case and how difficult was the marriage of the scope to the Pico7 software?

I just read your post, not sure if I confused you or you read my post incorrectly but I didn't buy or use Rotkee software. I only brought the test leads.

If you look at reply 18 all I did was use a generic voltage scale for the HT leads, I haven't had time to work out the kv scaling yet

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #29 - Jan 18^th, 2022 at 11:00am

Both the Pico and Autonerdz secondary leads have a ground lead attached with circuitry that will redirect secondary voltage to ground in the event of secondary insulation failure. This will destroy the lead, but hopefully save the scope and PC. I would strongly suggest that any other brand of secondary test lead you might use offers the same protection.

Brian Haley
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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #30 - Jan 18^th, 2022 at 12:47pm

Brian Haley wrote on Jan 18^th, 2022 at 11:00am:

Both the Pico and Autonerdz secondary leads have a ground lead attached with circuitry that will redirect secondary voltage to ground in the event of secondary insulation failure. This will destroy the lead, but hopefully save the scope and PC. I would strongly suggest that any other brand of secondary test lead you might use offers the same protection.

Excellent point!

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kicksbutt Guru Member Picogroup Offline I'm an Autonerd Posts: 252 litchfield park az Arizona USA	Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico?? Reply #31 - Jan 18^th, 2022 at 2:35pm yeah very good point
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autosparky

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Re: Have I wasted $$ on a Pico??
Reply #32 - Jan 18^th, 2022 at 11:16pm

Brian Haley wrote on Jan 18^th, 2022 at 11:00am:

Both the Pico and Autonerdz secondary leads have a ground lead attached with circuitry that will redirect secondary voltage to ground in the event of secondary insulation failure. This will destroy the lead, but hopefully save the scope and PC. I would strongly suggest that any other brand of secondary test lead you might use offers the same protection.

Not sure if your experiencing the same as me but the reason I stopped buying Pico leads is because they keep getting spiked for some reason and keep dying, think I have draw full of them

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