We just have to be the first to post up this never before seen scope power capture.

This is a Chrysler crank and cam capture.  Nothing new there.  But it has never been done like this before.

Screen time 200 seconds.  That's about 3 minutes and 20 seconds.
Zoom level 7508x
Engine RPM in this area 5000 RPM.
Sample interval 12 microseconds
16,666,672 samples per channel

Each pulse is still clearly defined.

Autonerdz has always been on the cutting edge since we posted the first PicoScope automotive image ever seen on iATN in 2001, ushering in a new era in automotive scopes.

Pico Technology has always been the leader in PC based scopes and why stop now?  Behold the 4000 series automotive scope.  Another quantum leap forward for Pico Technology.

Coming soon to your neighborhood.   ;)

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Tell us more :D




Tom

I was able to run two PicoScopes on one screen, upper is the 4223 and lower is the 3423. Check out the properties.
Brian

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Tom,

More on this within the week.  We are gearing up for launch.  A few details yet to be worked out but I think these will be available shortly.

The 3000 series scopes made all other automotive scopes a small dot in the rear view mirror.  This one is light years ahead of the rest.

Dual 80MHz ADCs
32,000,000 point internal sample buffer
100v inputs
20MHz bandwidth
12 bit

Not that this will diminish the value of the 3000 scopes at all.  These will never be obsolete and will continue to be fully supported.  The other brand x scopes won't catch up to these for many years to come.

But there will aways be something new from Pico.  Many of you remember when the 3000 scopes came out taking the lead over the 212 series.  The 3000 series has been the most powerful automotive scope in the world for years now.  Now maybe a week or two left holding that record.   That's all.  The only way to beat a PicoScope is with another PicoScope.   :)  

COOL

Some questions if I may.

How many channels?

Any progress in the raster/superimposed feature?

Running 3000 and 4000 series is there a pause in the pc resources like running P5 and P6?  

Thanks Sam

Sam,

Initial release will be the four channel model.  Two channel model at a later date.

Nothing on the raster and superimposed ignition views so far.


Quote:

Running 3000 and 4000 series is there a pause in the pc resources like running P5 and P6?

Not sure what you mean by this.  The 4000 seems to be less RAM intensive most of the time than the 3000.  The 4000 will use Pico 6 but not be supported by Pico 5.  There is no more active development on PicoScope 5.

I guess I was not clear.  I meant running two software applications at the same time.  Brian posted he used a 3000 and 4000 at the same time.  I have run pico 5 and 6 with two different scopes at the same time and it seems there was a delay at a consistent time basis of course I was running the signal generator at the same time.  I have this illustrated in some of my scope comparison videos.

Sam

Sam, It is possible to run the two different hardware versions at the same time on one screen using the same software. This was done for experimental purposes only, as I don’t think the captures could be synchronized. I can’t think of a practical application for this setup, just wanted to see if it could be done.
Brian

These new scopes are arriving here today.  We have a new page under construction now where you can get more information and purchase.

http://www.autonerdz.com/picoquad4000.htm

Autonerdz will be doing the world debut on the new scopes at the ATE show, so be sure to stop by our booth, if you are atttending:

http://www.atetrainingexpo.com/

This is the first time these will be exhibited anywhere.

Here are the first 4423 captures ever posted anywhere.....

Just playing with a four channel injector capture from a 2001 Hyundai 1.5.

No attenuators were needed due to the 100v channel inputs.

There are 100 seconds on the screen followed by a couple of zoom shots.

Look at the properties window.  6 microsecond sample interval.

This one screen data file is 30Mb

Just going to the extreme here just to see what it is capable of.

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Do you have a performance chart for the 4423 ?

Not yet Brian.  Due to different ways you can manage the power, making the chart will be way more complicated than the one for the 3000 scopes.

It's on the to do list though.

Is this a scope that you just set the time base to something stupid, like 500 ms or 2 sec a division, crank up the samples, and set this up as your base?

Or are there any reasons that there would be an advantage to "slowing down to go fast"?  It is very obvious that you probably cannot, within reason, go to fast, but there is usually some advantages to slowing down.

It's just that at this time I can't think of any!

John,

This is an insane amount of power.  Like a very powerful car, you can make all that power go up in tire smoke, or hook up and launch.

Yes, there are different settings for different scope strategies.  With the 3000 scopes, you can just dial them up to the max and pretty much leave it there for most anything you want to do..

Not so with these new scopes.  We will be producing tutorials on how to best control this power to the greatest benefit without wasting it.

When yours arrives, we can go through some of what we have come up with so you can hook up and launch   ;)

Reieved the pico newsletter today so it looks like it is the official release now.

There is a couple of terms in the literature I was curious about.

What is  flexray?

What is the 'always on memory'?

Thanks Sam

Sam,

Here is some information regarding FlexRay. The specifcations have been developed for automotive applications only. They have neither been developed, nor tested for non-automotive applications.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FlexRay

Sam,

The 'always on memory' means that the scope is always utilizing the internal 32meg sample memory.  Of course, the samples are stored there in block mode operation.  But, even in streaming modes, this memory is used to process the data in real time.  This helps free up the PC CPU load.

It's amazing how well this thing works with the massive amount of data it is capable of collecting.

Comparing a 50 second four channel Pico 4423 capture with a 52.4 second Modis capture, the Pico 4423 will sample over 133 times faster.  It will collect 133x more data on just one of multiple screens.   :o

This means that instead of samples being 400us apart they are only 3us apart.

That's like comparing speed between a VW bug and an F16.   ;)

One more question then since this is using P6 I am guessing there are still small gaps between screens.  Is this less so with the 4000 series hardware?

Sam,

Yes, there are gaps between each full screen buffer as they are placed into the scrolling capture buffer.

The size of the gaps depend on the scope settings.  The 4000 has a rapid trigger mode where the gaps are very very small but that is only at the faster time bases. (1ms/div and faster)

The gaps, at other block mode time bases using the 4000, can be considerably less while capturing more data but...

When you get into the longer streaming modes with samples jacked up, the gaps get much longer.  This is due to the fact that the PC has to write a LOT of data to the hard drive before continuing.  In the example above, this may be around 40MB for one screen.  That takes several seconds.  However, when you have such a large seamless capture time on one screen with all the detail you would ever need, the pause between screens is less relevant.

Keeping in mind that the 4423 can collect 8x more data than a 3423 at the 5s/div example above.  So, it's not surprising that it might take 8x longer to write it to the hard drive with those settings.

So......It depends   ;)

Here is another example.  

Channels IDs are in the notes.

A CKP
B CMP
C #1 Inj
D #1 Secondary

5s/div capture with 3 microsecond sample intervals on each of four channels.

You can still see clearly the compression and waste events for cyl #1 zoomed in 264x.   8-)

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Quote:

Autonerdz will be doing the world debut on the new scopes at the ATE show, so be sure to stop by our booth, if you are atttending: http://www.atetrainingexpo.com/ This is the first time these will be exhibited anywhere.

Guess there was one of these at Vision so the above statement was not entirely correct.  I did check the Vision site and Pico site to see if there were any exhibitions before ours but none were listed.  Nothing in the Pico newsletter about that either.  I have been known to be mistaken before  ;)

In any case, if you really want to see one as only Autonerdz can show you....ATE is the place to be.  

BTW Bryan,  I did put that 4423 performance chart together.  You can get it here:

http://www.autonerdz.com/cgi/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1236465435

Sorry...Picogroup members eyes only.

Very cool, thanks Tom.

Quote:

Guess there was one of these at Vision so the above statement was not entirely correct.

I'll confirm the 4423 was displayed at Vision. The vendor was unknown before my arrival.

I'm gutted.....

I bought my new 4 channel automotive kit two weeks too early  :'(

Steve...

Are there any upgrade options for the 4423 ? I just bought my 3423 kit in december. I think I read on here that there wasn't any just want to clarify.

Bryan,

There was no trade in upgrade policy in place until just recently.  It's kinda complicated but there are options now if your 3000 scope is less than 6 months old.

Contact me for details.


Steve,

Contact your vendor to find out what your trade in options are.

h